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I'm a founder at a high-growth startup in Mountain View. I always tell potential hires, "options are worth nothing until they're worth something. And, they may never be worth anything."

I think that's the opposite of the unrealistic optimism job candidates get. But I think it also helps set the stage for a culture of transparency and honesty very early. Even before that person becomes an employee.

I'm curios to know what HN'ers think of that explanation vs hearing only the optimistic case. Does it make you second guess the company prospects?



It strikes me as an honest statement and if you were pitching me I would give you honesty points :-)

But the problem you are dealing with is the problem in many questions here: these are complex financial instruments and most people don't understand them. Some people will hold false beliefs about these things. Some people will be afraid of the unknowns.

Also the problem is compounded because the word option has different meanings and if you wrongly believe that these employee stock options on private equity are the same thing as listed equity options you're in for a big surprise.

Generally when analyzing a compensation package if you have to do extensive scenario analysis to evaluate the package I think it is worse for most people than a simple package.

Also, the number of scenarios where the founder or investors can make decisions that render the option package worthless is fairly large. This creates a dynamic where if the employee takes an options heavy package they either were foolish / duped, or they are pledging their utmost trust and loyalty in the management team. It's a lot to ask.


Taken literally, this implies comparing offers strictly on cash+benefits, which typically skews things in favor of large companies.


Benefits could mean other things.

Many of us will take less money for remote options or more say in product development.

At my last company I left a few months before they sold. Been wondering if I made a mistake not buying my options. I was finally able to get the final selling price. It was half price per stock than the options were valued at. Looking back I made the right choice even thought it feels like I missed an opportunity.


> Does it make you second guess the company prospects?

Far from it, honest is one of the absolutely critical metrics I use to evaluate any prospective employer. Bravo.

I don't mind someone stating why they believe their start up will have a better chance of success than the average: it is a positive to believe in the product. But don't sell it as a sure thing.


I work in the DevOps/sys admin field, so I'm use to always looking at what could go wrong. I think this is a toss up depending on the persons experience with startups. I've been in mostly small sub 20 person startups for 15 years now so I've seen almost all of it.

You have the people who are new to startups, who think its a ticket to financial freedom in 4 years when they have fully vested and the company sells for 1+ billion. Those people might be scared away.

You have the people who have been through a few startups and have worked at a failed company or a company that the investors took all the money and left the common stock holders with nothing or little to nothing. I'm in this group and that would be a breath of fresh air to hear that. During interviews, if I hear only great things and nothing is wrong then that is a red flag to me.


I agree with the other folks commenting on your reply. I'd view it in a positive light. I'm always suspicious of founders that oversell startup equity.

The younger naive folks who walk away because you were too real will probably remember your candor in a positively Later on once they have some more life experience.


Personally, I would appreciate that level of candor (and that's how I view my options anyway). I've heard far too many pitches from desperate recruiters about how an options package is worth $$$$$$.




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