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Maybe it should be. The system here in the US has produced some great innovations at the cost of great misery among the non-wealthy. At a time when technology promises an easier life, it only seems to benefit the wealthy, while trying to discard everyone else. The light at the end of the tunnel is a 1%-er about to laughingly crush you beneath their wheels.

I don't think this is the strongest argument. Every technological revolution so far has initially benefited the wealthy and taken a generation or two for its effects to lift the masses out of previous levels of poverty, but ultimately each one has.

To me the stronger argument about AI is that this revolution won't. And that's because this one is not really about productivity or even about capital investment in things that people nominally would want (faster transport, cheaper cotton, home computers). This one is about ending revolution once and for all; it's not about increeasing the wealth of the wealthy, it's about being the first to arrive at AGI and thus cementing that wealth disparity for all perpetuity. It's the endgame.

I don't know if that's true, but that's to me the argument as to why this one is exceptional and why the capitalist argument for American prosperity is inapplicable in this case.


I don't know about for all perpetuity. If history has shown, anyone that reaches the pinnacle eventually becomes complacent, technology improves by becoming faster/cheaper/smaller. That just means it is prime to always be susceptible to a new something coming along that stands on the shoulders of what came before without having to pay for it. They start where the current leader fought to achieve.

The idea behind self improving AGI is that it will "get" every "new something coming along" before everyone else.

Self-improving AI is a rhetorical sleight of hand to make you think that.

Just because it can self improve doesn't mean it improves better than everything else or without substantial costs to develop improvement.


I personally believe magical unicorns are going to save us

We have had the capacity to have zero poverty for many decades, maybe over a century. China eliminated extreme poverty.

So has America. But the definition of poverty is not absolute positioned, to borrow a CSS analogy. Poverty gets defined relative to wealth. Overall, this is a good thing. But knowing that your poverty is rich compared to the poverty of two generations ago doesn't satisfy humans who gauge their relative social position and are unhappy with it.

I routinely see homeless people what are you going on about

Have you ever seen one who was starving? Do they lack access to clean drinking water? Are there malnourished children, without access to schools, begging in America?

Have you ever been to a country where there was extreme poverty?

When people talk about China eliminating extreme poverty, that has a specific international definition. From Wikipedia:

Extreme poverty is the most severe type of poverty, defined by the United Nations (UN) as "a condition characterized by severe deprivation of basic human needs, including food, safe drinking water, sanitation facilities, health, shelter, education and information. It depends not only on income but also on access to services". Historically, other definitions have been proposed within the United Nations.

Extreme poverty mainly refers to an income below the international poverty line of $1.90 per day in 2018 ($2.66 in 2024 dollars), set by the World Bank.[0]

The average homeless person in America spends several times that amount on drugs, and all of the above services are available to them. Homelessness in America is a societal failure, but it does not meet the definition of extreme poverty.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extreme_poverty


I don’t know about that. The poor from just about every other country in the world seem desperate to live in America. While American capitalism has many faults, oppressing the bottom quintile is not one of them. The US median income is consistently top ten globally.

Median income doesn't tell much if you don't factor in the cost of living. My salary sucks compared to what I would earn in America, but when I factor in things like free healthcare, daycare and higher level education, I'm better off here.

What countries offer free daycare? I know there are a few in Europe. It's not super common, so I'm curious to know where


That doesn't look free. Subsidized, yes. Lots of countries subsidize childcare. Including every US state

Sure, but extremely cheap collared with the us.

Here's a UNICEF report comparing childcare policy amongst rich countries: https://www.unicef.org/innocenti/reports/where-do-rich-count...

Sweden ranks third in the comparison metric (what good is free childcare if it is very bad or inaccessible?), and the us ranks 40th out of 41.


The US does a good job of selling the idea of living here and getting rich, though it does a better job of selling it to people who aren't already embedded in daily life in the US. While we have, perhaps, much lower numbers of extreme poverty compared to a lot of countries, as one of the richest countries, and growing richer by the day, we should have zero extreme poverty. The people with the will to fix our poverty lack the money and very few with money have no real desire to help the less fortunate.

>The poor from just about every other country in the world seem desperate to live in America

Immigration to the USA, both illegal and legal, has cratered.


This is completely wrong. Even “the poor” in most parts of the world has a pretty good life weight where they are.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hVimVzgtD6w&pp=ygUMSGFucyByb3N...


Apparently, one AI is not enough to prevent websites from shenanigans.

Don't forget the sweetheart tax rebates they sometimes get for promises of development.

"Moles from bigTech …" What the what now?


I’ll add Pask Makes to that list. Not specifically machining, but he does do some work with a mill.

Also, Uri Tuchmann, who is way more fun and much weirder than a lot of machinists.


I live in the US and I would happily buy a Chinese EV if the price was right. However, there is no price for which I will buy a Tesla, ever.


That might have worked if we had established that right after WWII, but it would never get off the ground now. The current system is too entrenched.


You have a president that’s willing to wage war on institutions of higher learning. If anything this is the only time it’s even been remotely possible.


When people are desperate to invest, they often don't care what someone actually can do but more about what they claim they can do. Getting investors these days is about how much bullshit you can shovel as opposed to how much real shit you shoveled before.

Thus has it always been. Thus will it always be.


> segueing into something that might be embarrassing

Like his support of racist organizations in Europe? Or hiding information about failures of self-driving automobiles? Or unexpected layoffs? There's probably a lot more, involving SpaceX, etc.

Honestly, that first one alone merits a lot of hairy eyeballing, but I despise racists and hate that my home state is associated with them.


It’s interesting that only now he is stepping back now that he’s been found out. It demonstrates that it’s not about ethics or morals, but about publicity and damage control.


it's the good old eleventh commandment, "thou shalt not get caught"


How do we know that whoever asked him to step down already privately knew?


most of what we know today we knew years ago, too


The tax paying class of the world just have to watch all this horseshit go on, watch the institutions and the law enforcement agencies protect these people with our hard earned money, meanwhile if we break a single law, there are consequences for us, sometimes massive.

It's a bullshit world we're living in, but I guess it's always been the same?

It seems for the wealthy, raping children is an acceptable pastime and we're just supposed to accept that it's ok?


It's a big club, and we ain't in it.


(I know you're referencing Carlin, but) a big club it is not. You might even say it's just the "top 1%" or even less.


Top 0.1% is still a VERY big club, just in the US > 300.000.


This is the 0.1% of the 0.1%


> It's a bullshit world we're living in, but I guess it's always been the same?

> It seems for the wealthy, raping children is an acceptable pastime and we're just supposed to accept that it's ok?

This category of malcontent (about out-of-touch elites engaging in all sorts of depraved perversions while the poor starved) at Versailles eventually caused most of the former to lose their heads during the French Revolution.

The smart ones know that they need to keep up appearances, the dumb ones behave like they will never face consequences.


The smart ones are building bunkers to escape the hell that the US will become when the civil war actually starts. They're not hoping to survive the apocalypse, they're just hoping to ride out the 20 or 30 years of war and return as actual Lords for the serfs that are left after we kill each other.


Yes I know of someone who willingly gave up their US citizenship for tax reasons but has EU, Israeli, and a bunch of other citizenships. They get to live a good life in the Netherlands + traveling the world while the US tears itself apart and then when it is time to retire in 30-40 years, the country will be ripe of the picking..they will buy their citizenship back through one of the multiple buy your way into the US visa programs...and retire in Montana.


And the US never revolted against our domestic aristocracy, as they never revolted against our clergy.

Wonder how it would have turned out if the French revolution happened before the American Revolution? What could we have learned from them?


By most metrics, it's almost always been worse. But that doesn't make the modern era suck any less.


Not according to the metrics proposed by Graeber & Wengrow in the last chapter of Dawn of Everything

> The three freedoms that most of our ancestors enjoyed, but which most modern humans lack are:

> The freedom to leave.

> The freedom to disobey an order.

> The freedom to create new ways of relating to one another.

https://drdevonprice.substack.com/p/the-three-fundamental-hu...


Eh, there's a tremendous amount of projecting a particular modern viewpoint onto the past in that work. It's a bit nonsense.


Admittedly, I only read a brief review of the book, but it was suggesting the opposite.

And example: we tend to inject too much of our modern viewpoint onto the old monarchies—that Henry VIII would not have thought himself ruler of the "state" of England although we talk about him in that regard from our modern perspective.


Yeah I agree with that. And I'd argue that it is still the same nowadays. People at the top probably knows clearly which interest group they are in, and which group they can rally up, and which ones they need to fight to the death -- even if they all belong to the same nationality -- and I'm not surprised if local interest groups ally with "foreign" interest groups to fight another local interest group. It is blurred.


That book is "rethinking" history but that rethinking curiously fits extremely well with a particular modern narrative. Some people eat it up. But separate a few decades in the future and it will seem like an extremely fad-driven interpretation of things.


The book makes a point of how historical analysis was already fit extremely well into particular contemporary fad narratives of the time. It does as much deconstruction of that (and of the idea that those contemporary fads were timeless elements of human nature) as it does construction of new ones. The former is a very interesting part of the book you’re not addressing. I don't know what you add to this conversation with such breezy dismissal...


And would most of those metrics you allude to happen to have been brought to us by institutions like Harvard, or the US Treasury Department?


I'm talking about disease prevention, maternal mortality, infant mortality, access to clean water, anesthetic(!!) and access to things like reading glasses and hearing aids and oh, I don't know, refrigeration.

What does your precious Harvard and US Treasury Department have to say about that?


I think the topic though was corrupt abuses of power, lack of justice or accountability for the wealthy—those kinds of things.


Taking a longer view of history...

One metric of change would be that statutory (underage) rape wasn't a crime anywhere 200 years ago. In some countries, it still isn't. Mass rape and kidnapping is going on right now from Nigeria to Sudan. Wealthy old men can still marry 12 year olds across much of the Middle East. The fact that sex with minors has become relegated to something like a luxury designer drug for the elite hypocrites in the US and UK, and the fact that they're now being exposed for it, is in many ways an unexpected victory for humanity. The previous 5k years of recorded history, and probably the whole million years before that, were wall to wall with war, slavery and raping children. As well as the elites having such rights as prima nocta and simply executing anyone they wished. So I think we are making progress.


Brought to you by Steven Pinker, another one of Epstein's associates.


"The big thieves hang the little thieves"


I understand you want to highlight this, but you don’t have to begin your sentence with "It's interesting that..." because this is not interesting or novel in the slightest.


You are entitled to your opinion and they theirs.


I assume that someone begining a sentence that way is implying "It is interesting to me that…" and I cut them some slack.


It's interesting to me because how the hell did he think this was going to end? "Innocent until proven guilty" doesn't work in the court of public opinion. So, if one was even peripherally associated with Epstein, it would seem like that would be a hell of a liability.

On a side note, did Epstein have employees on his sex island and what happened to them?


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